Tarot Lori: Big Deck Energy

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Music.

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Hello everyone. I'm Jann Arden. We have a very special guest today on the Jann Arden podcast. Not only is Caitlin green and Sarah Burke here, as always, from their homes in Toronto, but Lori Dyan is here, and she has a brand new book called big deck energy. If you have ever been curious about tarot cards, if you've ever just wanted to be inspired or have some optimism injected into your life, if you've just wanted to know more about tarot cards, how they can be part of your lives, this is the book for you. Lori Dyan

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, thank you. Welcome to the Jan Arden pod. How are you? And tell me everything about big deck energy, Jan

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and Caitlin and Sarah, thank you so much for having me and Jan. I love seeing you with some big deck energy.

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Yeah, I feel like I've got it going on. So I was sent this book several weeks ago, and also been asked, you know, for a little a quote and a blurb, which I'm so thrilled about. This is a lot different from your last book, big

1:10  
deck energy is honestly a lesson in manifesting. It's like a master class in manifesting, because it's the first book that I actually wrote that got me the agent that got me the meeting with Harper Collins that brought about burn your shit, which was the first book. It's just they're coming out in the opposite order. And big deck energy started as a PDF document that I was going to include in my little zoom workshop that I recorded many years ago. This book is about 10 years in the making, so it was already done when I went looking for an agent, because I started thinking, maybe this could be more than just a PDF on my website. Maybe it could be self published, or maybe I could get an agent. Maybe it could be a big five publisher. And it just grew and grew. And what was interesting is when I finished burn your shit, then I thought, well, the second book is already done, perfect. But a month before it was due, with the publisher, big deck energy, they reminded me that I had to actually rewrite about two thirds of it because it needed to match the tone and everything of burn your shit. So I had to write about 40,000 words in a month over Christmas a couple of years ago, and it is every single card, because I did want to give people, you know, you can get taro 101, interpretations online for free. So I wanted to give my interpretation, which has grown over time, because you do develop a dialog with your deck, and also give people the confidence to develop their own dialog. And get into the history of tarot, because it's bananas too, and and just different ways that you can pull cards, and how it can be a tool for self discovery or connection with the divine, or whatever you want it to be like, it's not magic, but it's kind of magical.

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It is magical. Caitlin, over to you, because I know you got questions. Well, I've

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had a reading with Lori, and I had it at a pivotal I had it about a year ago today, and so it was at a really pivotal point in my life. I had just been let go for my job at chum, and I was sort of wondering, you know, what the heck to do. And I've followed Lori for a long time on social and always really enjoyed her tidbits, her card of the day, her energy, the vibe she was bringing. But the one on one session was really just the next level. And a friend of mine, who's going through another huge transition in her life, recently had a reading with Lori, and I had already told her. I said, you know, if you have a chance to talk to her quickly, it's always going to be great, and if you follow her on social, always going to be a 10. However, the readings that you do are so in depth and so helpful, and your exact interpretation of the cards is, I think, what is so valuable and why people are going to be so interested in this book. Because, like you said, I can Google Tarot. I can, like, Google what any of these cards mean? I have friends who who read tarot for fun, but I think because you've been doing this so long, you're such an expert at kind of, like, you say, bringing the woo, woo without the cuckoo, that I really appreciated. It felt very like, oh yeah, this makes perfect sense. This is so clear. And we recorded a video of it, and I will go back, or I'll show Friends who kind of don't believe the stuff that I tell them all the time about astrology or taro or whatever, and I'll show them a clip of the video, and I'll be like, see, see this part. So I'm really looking forward to how this book can sort of empower people. And if someone is, say, a critic or like Jan had said they're Tarot curious, what would you advise them in terms of, like, where to start in this book? If they just pick this book up, if they if they look, if they get an audio book or whatever, where should they go?

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Just like, burn your shit? I like to have fun with it. I want there to be zero barrier to entry for this stuff, because I know how powerful it can be rituals Tarot. I want to get it in the hands of as many people as possible, because I know how profound and lasting the shifts can be that come from the guidance that these cards can offer. And I make it kind of fun and cheeky. So there's a I'm getting goosebumps just talking about you guys. There's a chapter in this book called Tarot Tinder, and it's getting to know your cards. So it's a way that you can just, you know, pull a card every day, and before you look at the little book, or at my book. Like, you know, there's always a little booklet that comes with your deck. Before you look at anything, just look at the card, and what does this make me feel? How am I responding to the colors or the imagery or the number or the symbolism? What is it saying to me? And journal that then you go live your life, and you look at the card at the end of the day, and then you see how that message showed up in your day. And that's a really good way to get to know a card and to see it. It's like a prompt. It's like a journal prompt, but a life prompt. The

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thing I wanted to ask you that I was curious about from the very first like 10 pages, when I was looking at the illustrations of the cards, the first question I had was, Are these images of these illustrations in your book? Are they from your deck of cards that you love and use all the time.

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They are they're the same deck, but not my particular deck, because my deck is so old that the pictures are very worn, but it's called the Rider Waite Smith deck, and that's sort of like the OG tarot deck that's been around for over 100 years.

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I did go online and I looked at Tarot like on Amazon. I just was curious coming into this interview, and I saw, you know, probably 15 decks right off the go that have different themes. Like there was a fairy theme, there was a, I'm just making stuff up now with, like, a rainbow theme and a frog theme, but there was all these different theme decks that were still the queen of wands, you know, the seven of wands. It was all that stuff, but the illustrations were completely different. Does that affect how people like, their reaction to looking at the image like I just wanted to ask that question

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100% Jen, that's a great point, because picking your deck is a very personal experience. Some people hear that it needs to be a gift. I thought that, and then the witch who ended up mentoring me on the cards 35 years ago laughed in my face. She's like, you don't need to do that. Just get your deck. And when you get a deck, there are decks. There's a Housewives Tarot cards, where it's 50s housewives, and it's like the seven of rolling pins. I mean, it's ridiculous. There are a bazillion cat tarot decks. There's one from the 70s. It's all boobs and bush. It's all naked people. It is like the cast of hairspray. It's 70s. It's wild. And people brought them to when I would teach workshops in person, they would bring them and I'd think, Oh, what is this deck? But I've seen it around like all of their moms had this deck. So you can get any theme that speaks to you, and as long as it's within the system of Tarot that is rooted in the Rider Waite Smith deck, then you will be okay, because you know, the five of coins is going to or pentacles is going to be a similar ish kind of message across the board, but then it's just meant as a starting point. A lot of the card interpretations that I have on the surface seemingly have nothing to do with the Tarot 101 so I'll often say, Okay, this is the Tarot 101 but now we're going to get into my interpretation, and my interpretation and and the Tarot one interpretation are not as important as your interpretation, like you want to let all three inform you. I just want

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to give you an example of how fun this book is big deck energy, like we said. That tells you a little bit. So chapter eight is fools and kings for dinglings. And I love that, because I think what's important for me as a reader and a first timer going into this is that it's supposed to be fun sometimes too, that it doesn't have to have these occultish overtones. There's a lot of people in there that think that it's the devil's work and to do any kind of foreshadowing, you know, telling them what job they should take, and things like that, you know, all that crap. It's meant to be fun sometimes too, but very inspiring. I was so inspired and uplifted by the reading that we had because I was doing like some health things. But one of the cards you pulled, you said, you're gonna you're gonna live a long time. Now, some people would say, you know, that's only for God to say how long you're going to live whatever Well, I also say it's for my brain too, and how I'm going to make my way through the world. So anyway, long question, but I'll let you answer that

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well, and I think I never do prophecies or fortune telling. That's why it's the woo, woo without the cuckoo. Everyone has free will. You can take the it's like just giving you a little peek behind the curtain to see what's going on energetically, and what you choose to do with the information is up to you. And I know I can tell which card it was, is probably the 10 of cuffs that you got. That is the most reassuring card of the deck for me. And it says, you know, don't worry so much what the last day on earth looks like, because there are a lot of days between now and then. But I would never say you're gonna live to be 80 or check your pancreas or say goodbye to the dog. I mean, I would never that's ridiculous.

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And most people that even do readings don't do that kind of foreshadowing either. They don't say on Tuesday, don't go out of the house, there will be a bus running you over. Like, maybe that's old timey movie stuff. Yes, I really find it very inspirational. And like I said, Is it our minds kind of tricking us? I think it's a little bit of everything. I believe in energy, more now in my life than I ever, ever had as a young person. I believe in my intentions. I believe that I that we all walk on our intentions and that and I believe in manifestation, and maybe. Can speak to that a little bit more. Lori, about how, you know, getting a reading can inspire us to manifest a better life for ourselves, because you definitely did that for me.

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I'm so happy to hear that. Jen, and that is my intention. I always stayed at the beginning of a reading. My intention to is inspire, empower and enlighten. So I'm being very clear in what my reading is about. And if someone else comes and says, you know, their intention is to scare the crap out of you, they probably will. So it's all about Tarot being a tool and how you choose to use it. And with these cards, I always say they're just pieces of paper with pretty pictures on them. The reason that when I do card of the day on Instagram, and I think half the time the message is just for me, and then I post it, and I get messages all day long. How did you know that's my message? Oh my gosh, it's because these pictures are rooted in archetypes, and archetypes are like the language of the Divine. They're the language of humanity. They explain, they explain the collective unconscious that we are all sort of plugged into. And so that's why a card. And it's so funny, I didn't, I didn't stack the deck here or anything. This is just good Woo, Woo is you said about the intentions of manifesting. And I just grabbed a card off of the top of the deck here, and it's the two of wands, which is all about getting clear on your intention, which is this first step of manifesting. So it's an example of how if you wanted to manage, like Taro is coming through with the good podcast support, if you wanted to create something in your life, in whatever area of your life, and you got the two of wands, then it's telling you, okay, you have to get really crystal clear on what you want. Don't get tied to it, thinking that it can't evolve over time as you evolve, but state what you want. Get clear on what that intention is, so that you because any action you take is preceded by intention. So you need to know what it is you want, and then get off your butt and get going. And there are other cards that are a kick in the ass that will tell you to get off your butt and get going. And it's funny, because I'm always telling people there are no bad tarot cards, just bad tarot card readers. And when there are the so called scary cards, or bad cards like death or the tower the devil, they're not bad cards. They're just saying you got some work to do, babe. And there are usually other cards that come across from it in a spread, you know, or beside it in a spread that will be dangling the carrot going, Look at this. You Who

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did we get a bad card. We did. We pulled a card in our last time having you on one of our recording sessions. And you were like, I know it looks scary, but

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I mean, probably I give that preface to a number of the cards, because it's like, this doesn't look great. The guy's dead in the swamp, bunch of swords sticking out of him. But trust me, there were swords. I remember that. Yeah, it might have been that one.

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I have a question. I'm kind of wondering if you have any thoughts on why women are so much more into tarot and mysticism and all this stuff than men. And I guess I could give a little asterisk of of straight men, because a lot of my gay male friends are really into this stuff with me also. But it feels like it's a very feminine energy space.

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Absolutely, I think it is definitely something, you know, anything esoteric when it's intuition, the emotion, not to get too binary, but those are aspects of the divine feminine, and we each have the divine feminine and the divine masculine within us. The Divine Masculine is being boundaried and taking action and being the protector and the provider, not in a toxic masculinity, narcissism kind of way, but just in a taking care of your business kind of way, that's very empowering. The feminine, the divine feminine is the nourishing and the creating and the cultivating, and it is the unseen and the end the moon is very feminine energy, and that's all about intuition and emotion. So I think that everyone can have access to this. I think a lot of people, regardless of how they express themselves with their gender, are just cut off from it or shut down from it. But I'll tell you what, when I get dudes sitting across from me for a reading, they're always like, okay, tarot, lady, okay, well, let's see what you got. And I just I'm like, Okay, babe, let's do it. And by the end of it, I more often than not, have to say, Dude, you have to go. I have to see other people here, like, come on. Because they're like, Can I ask one more question? Just one more. Just one more. It's hilarious. They just need an opportunity and an invitation. Those

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stereotypes are not good for anybody. Stereotypes about any kind of gender roles are not serving humanity whatsoever. It's nice to know that the guys do hang around a bit longer because they realize they're in a safe space. They're talking to you, and they can let their guard down, and that must feel really wonderful, and to have someone encourage you, like more than anything, what I've learned just in my life is encouraging people around me has been, like, really cool to watch it unfold, like the people in my band that I've worked with for 30 years. So within these cards and the construct and the meanings of the cards, there's also that human connection of encouraging someone and telling them you can do better. You can get past this. You can overcome Yeah. You will feel less sad. And it's like it's such a combination of things that I think these readings entail. And the book too, made me laugh out loud. Many, many times, like the judgment card, judgment is calling you on here, shit talking,

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yes, and can I just say if I make you laugh? Jen, that is such a compliment, and thank you for saying that, because you make me laugh all the time. So if I can tickle your funny bone, that, to me, is like, Damn. That is a badge of honor that I wear with immense pride. So thank you

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well, but I think this appeals to so many age groups, whether you're a 16 year old guy in Lloydminster or a 92 year old woman in Thunder Bay, the way you've put this book together. And I'm still so blown away by this was the first one. Anyway. I'm so glad it turned out the way it did. But just going through there's just laugh out loud stuff, because you're able to not take yourself seriously. And Caitlin was talking about this last week about her green light that welcomes her into digging a person and to liking a person and to feeling a connection with a person. And it was humor. Hey, Caitlin, 100%

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and I think that is also kind of what Laurie's lightness, which is funny because, like you said, Jan, it's frequently this is viewed as this occult space in this kind of dark and dreary world. But I think that aspect of Lori's humor and her light and her Her good nature just comes through in her writing and in her social presence. So I was like, Oh, this is for me, like, this is the type of stuff that I like. I like. What I'm getting from this. I like that. It's not shroud in all of this weirdness. For me, it felt much more accessible and much more entertaining. To be honest, it makes you more curious about it, and sort of it has an ability to make Tarot stick with you for longer, because it's fun. That's

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my hope and my intention. Because, like you said, I've given a reading to a truck driver in Newfoundland who was pulled off at a roadside truck stop and was doing it in the cab of his truck. And there are, you know, celebrities, but there's also the stay at home mom and I deal with a lot of I mean, not to get back to the dudes, but I deal with a lot of business people who bring me in to give guidance around their companies. This is all very much on the download. No one's talking about this on their Instagram or their annual report. I hope it's the Liberal Party.

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It's Elon Musk, isn't it?

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No, I would have to burn my deck too much big deck energy. Yeah, enough. I

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was just gonna say that,

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maybe just for everyone who's listening at home, can you visually, kind of walk us through how you lay your cards out and what that looks like for your reading. Is that really private information or because I remember you, we talked about the past, we talked about the present, we talked about the future. So for anyone listening right now, is there any way that you could kind of just walk us through how you place your cards and what a reading looks like for people, and what those positions mean and how many cards there is such

18:08  
a good question, no reading is the same. I mean, one card can give you a very robust and juicy message. Three cards, then we're really cooking with gas for my readings. It's actually based on a spread that was developed by the legit witch who mentored me on Tarot from Calgary, Alberta. And it's based on astrology. So it's 12 cards in a circle, kind of like a clock, and each card is in a different astrological position, which represents a different area of your life. And she would sort of go around the clock. And what I do, it's evolved over time. She gave me, she taught me on that spread, and I and she, you know, gave me permission to work with it as as whatever way worked for me, and it evolved over time. So now I actually don't really bother with the astrology part, because I read the cards in pairs across from one another. So when you see those 12 cards in a circle, I'm reading 12 o'clock with six o'clock, one o'clock was seven o'clock, and we go around the circle, and as a as you go around the circle, it tells the story of you. So it's not specific, like, this is romance, this is, you know, this is career, this is health. Because we don't live our lives in those verticals, right? It's, it's more like a woven fabric, and all of these parts of your life are woven together, and the cards intertwine in different variations. So it does get really I always say Tarot is playing 7d chess, and we're all just playing checkers, because I read these cards in pairs across from one another, but also the points of the spread. If you imagine that circle clock, it could be the north, the south, the West and the East that are talking to each other, or it could be two cards beside each other. So they just get really deep meanings that pertain to all areas of life, because Tarot is telling you, you know, girl, you got to unclench stop. Trying to be so controlling. They're not just saying that about, oh, your work relationships. That's like, No, you have to unclench full stop. It must be

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interesting seeing people's expressions light. Up as the information is going in their head, where their brain finds that point of reference, where it's an aha moment, and it really is quite stunning. People haven't considered things for years. They've let certain parts of their life just lie quiet and dormant and feel like it's not worth resurrecting. Oh, I've tried that. I'm not going to keep doing that. I'll never be lucky in love. I can't get the job that I want. This foot's been sore for six years. My toenail keeps falling off when they have a moment where, like I said, that encouragement part of it, that's what I find fascinating. I can't express how important that is in this particular time in our history, it is really dark out there. Yes,

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I feel I have a friend who's a shaman, and she said, especially for women of a certain age, it's like we've all been working towards this moment our entire lives. Because we're not going to be oracles and prophecies, you know, showing the way out, but we are going to be at least my mission. I really feel it's my purpose, and my mission is to ignite, Ooh, I got goosies ignite in people, their own growth, their own awakening, their own reckoning, in their own lives, and then they can take it out in the world. So it's like she told two friends, who told two friends who told two friends it has a massive impact, and through the book or being, you know, on podcasts and things like that, I love working one on one, but I also want to expand even more to working with one to many, you know, because the the way that the world is, you know, going down the pooper is, is corresponding with this uprising in a different way of thinking, a different way of being in the world. And a lot of people are out there helping to support that in others. And that's sort of how I see my work,

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almost like Caitlin. I think it was, it might have been last week, few episodes ago, but you were saying, like, I've had enough of this. Like, go put your energy to good use somewhere. Like, get involved with your local I know we're, you know, veering to politics for two seconds here, but you know, whatever you're feeling, just on your own by participating in a collective mission, there's, like, way more power there. So is that kind of what you're getting it there. Lauren, Yep,

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absolutely. They just don't have the faith in the institutions that we've worked with in the past and the organizations. So they're going local, going grassroots, going in their communities. I think that's great, because that's how we started, you know,

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yeah, I agree. And I always think back on, you know, the it's a funny example, because it's not political, but it is something that really worked well, and that was Mothers Against Drunk Driving. Mothers Against Drunk Driving is like this grassroots organization of moms and did not work within the structure of government or public policy, was able to affect more positive change to end drunk driving than many people who were working within government systems ever could. So I do think that that's where a lot of people find themselves now, and can also account for why I think so many people are searching for things like tarot and like astrology, and why these areas are seeing such a big resurgence, is because people are desperately seeking community, like minded people, and something to make them feel more positive about the future and to bring A little bit of positive action that way. There's this feeling I have with so many of my friends that I talk to where everyone's seeking. They're seeking something. They want some clarity about themselves, and they want to know how they fit into the world around them as it changes so quickly, that's

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100% and that's taro rituals, this kind of stuff that has been sort of cast aside as woowoo or magic, or just, you know, Hocus Pocus, people are going back to it because there's a reason this stuff has lasted hundreds and sometimes 1000s of years, and I feel

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like sometimes it comes back when people need it. I'm like, Well, we were all living in some nice cotton candy land where the economy was going okay, and, you know, governments and organizations felt more stable, so people didn't need to search for these other areas, and now everything's just gonna it's, you know, it's all kind of a roller coaster. You're going up, you're going down, and when you start to go down a little bit, or it feels like you're going down a little bit, people become more curious, and they search these things out. And I'm like, this stuff was always there for you, and it always

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made sense. I think most human beings do need to figure out how to focus their energy. And we talk about that in relation to children at school paying attention, whether it's paying attention to relationships or being able to focus at work or to be able to sleep better. It's always about funneling that energy that you need to complete a task into a place. And I think Tarot is one of those things that really can help you to just slow down, be in the moment, listen to what's being said, having a connection with another person from across the table. And I think that's lacking in our society and in our world. A work lunch, you ain't gonna get done. I'm sorry. You're in there. You're distracted. You keep looking at your watch. The waitress hasn't come by yet with your food. We gotta be out of here in 10 minutes. Like to actually sit down at. Think that must be an important part of what you do is the sit down and once again, going back to the guy that wants to stay the extra 10 minutes and ask three more questions, because who does he have in his life? Male, female, otherwise, to sit across and to have a conversation with that he's not going to be ridiculed, uh, demoralized, laughed at, yeah and not taken seriously. Yeah, it

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is a really sacred moment. It really is. And I think people feel really seen as well as heard, because it's, it's mostly me talking for the hour, as you all can attest, like, I don't shut up until the last five minutes. Like, do you have questions? And questions are usually left to the end, because what you have questions for addressed in the reading. But I think tarot, I always say it's like, the way I do it is a conversation with your soul, and I'm the interpreter. It's like life coaching, and you get more done in that hour, because it's like, we're jumping from the first date to the 50th. You're an

25:56  
energy coach. Oh, I love that, because I think that's exactly what you do.

26:00  
Thank you. Are you my new marketing manager? Do we

26:04  
not need one of those? I need one of those every waking moment of my day.

26:08  
Laurie, have you ever thought about, you know, building out something like an app? Maybe even I

26:13  
have. I have a lot of plans percolating up here, but I do have support, but I'm mostly still like a one person production here, so I'm doing as much they can. I mean, as you saw with me trying to get this microphone working, I'm not out here building apps like my only app is an artichoke dip. Let's be honest.

26:34  
I see, you know, now there's this juggernaut of success and interest from the public and all these spaces and another, you know what's funny, another West Coast Canadian in this field is Chani Nicholas. I'm not sure if

26:47  
I love I want to be the Chani Nicholas of taro. I've said many times I love her.

26:51  
Yeah, for our listeners that don't know who that is, please expand just a little bit. Caitlin. She's

26:57  
an astrologer, and she really, I think, hit it big. I want to say, within the last five years, on disseminating information, very detailed information, full chart readings, everything to do with astrology, your your sun, your rising, your nodes, like all this stuff. And so she built an app called Chani, and again, full name Chani Nicholas. She's originally from British Columbia. She's had a really interesting life. I have her book as well, and I just love that. It's sort of like, you know, these Canadian women who are making a go of it in this field, and that is exactly what I think of when I think of you. Lori, is like, you could do this for Taro, because I think you have that same vibe and ability to share this information widely in a way that people can absorb and want to hear more about. Well,

27:36  
thank you, Caitlin and any app developers listening, please get in touch@taro.la on Instagram, because I would love to do an app. I'm doing a lot more workshops too. I led a ritual retreat at Canyon Ranch Spa in California, and yeah, and that manifested. So I was there as their expert speaker for a weekend retreat, which was fantastic. And I'm looking at doing more of that, and just being able to take the tools of my trade that I've accumulated over the decades and be able to put, particularly women, in an immersive experience, whether it's a day or a week. You know, I can pull these different tools, and we do these different witchy things. We're burning shit, we're manifesting, we're doing. There's tarot, obviously, and women come out of these things, and men the Canyon Ranch thing was, was everyone was there, and it was wild. And again, the men were up there, crying, burning their shit. It was fantastic. I just listened

28:33  
to last night a discussion on sub stack between Shannon watts, who really used the Mothers Against Drunk Driving template for what she's doing, and Brooke Baldwin, who we know, formerly from CNN, the sexuality thing. Yes, there was a big theme in that conversation, and I'll link to it actually in the show notes, if anybody wants to read or watch about it. But they were talking about spirituality and sexuality being very interconnected, and we've talked a lot about women in this conversation. I'm wondering, like in this almost era of being ready to lean into this stuff, if you think that there's some themes of getting in touch with your your sexuality, or just what you need, you know, in connection with spirituality, because that's a lot of

29:15  
what you do, too. Oh yeah, absolutely. I think that it's hell yes. I think that it's very it's the awakening, it's the it's women. I tell so many women in their readings, your mantra moving forward is, it's my turn, and what do I want? And I get to have this, and that can be applied to every area of life. And when you apply it to one area of life, let's say work, and you're not applying it in your sexual life, there's going to be a disconnect and a discomfort there. So it's about stepping into your power in every aspect sexuality being just one part of it. But if you think about, I mean, women are the most powerful because we create life. I mean, we grow people inside us like we have the ability to and. Humanity relies on that, you know. So there's immense power in that, and it has been repressed and attempts to extinguish that. So there is, when I'm talking about this uprising that's happening and igniting this in women, it's we're unleashing dragons out there, not in a Blake Lively, Taylor Swift way, but in like, a like, in a serious,

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there's that humor again.

30:34  
I wanted to try something fun, and I don't want to put you on the spot, but because I have big deck energy here, I was wondering if it's possible. I've just been holding on to this book, and I've just been kind of thinking about the four of us as we sit here and have this conversation. Would it be possible if I just flip through the book and landed on a card, and perhaps we can just do a just a moment or two on this card, and perhaps how it pertains to our day.

31:03  
That is the coolest thing, Jen, because it's having a Tarot reading without the actual cards. You're just opening to a book, which is a beautiful way people can use this as well. You don't even need a deck of cards. You are like the CMO of tarot, Lori now, because that's amazing as well. And one thing, though, that made me kind of get a bit sweaty as you started to ask the question. I thought you were going to quiz me on the cards, because here's something I love to tell people, because it freaks them out. If you ask me, what is the seven of swords? I have no idea. I can't think of what that card looks like. I have no clue. I've never known and I got so caught up for so many years thinking like, How can I be a tarot reader if I don't even know what this card is, but you show me the seven of swords. I'm talking about it for hours. Okay,

31:46  
you're gonna have to join us on YouTube for this part, if you're just listening. Chance

31:50  
closed her eyes. She's leaning her head back, the star. I love the

31:53  
star. Okay, the star is, for me, one of the luckiest cards in the deck. Okay, it is. And when it comes to these luck cards, it's never just saying, here's all of your luck. It's saying, Here's your lesson that you need to learn to help you harness that luck, tap into it and really work with it. And the star lesson is all about the role that Destiny plays in our lives, and how you know fate and destiny, The Good, the Bad, the Ugly. It's all part of our path. And certain people, opportunities, experiences show up for a reason and a season. You know, it's people coming to be the student, the teacher, the guide, the mirror, the lesson, whatever it is. And it's not saying everything happens for a reason, because they think that's dumb. But out of everything that happens, you know, there's certain things that can be taken from that, even if it's being able to hold space for someone down the road in a way you could not have otherwise that kind of stuff, and that's your destiny. Then what you choose to do with it when it shows up is up to you, because you have free will. So learn from it. Ignore it. Kick its ass. Let it kick your ass, whatever it is. But don't get too caught up in trying to figure out what's the meaning, what's the purpose, what's the message that because the star wants you to just take that lucky Stardust and shove it in your pocket, hit the road and go do your thing, and then there will usually be an opportunity down the road to look back and say, Okay, I get why that happened. Okay, that makes sense. And we always want to know in advance rather than retrospect. And that's not how it works. But I kind of want to go deeper. And this is a, I mean, that is already a little different from the Terra 101, but for me now the star, and this only started happening in the last five years or so. I go even deeper on this card now, and I want you to consider this. The Star wants us to remember we are born alone and we die alone, but from the moment we're born to the moment we pass, it's like our souls join hands with other souls, whether it's parents or teachers or lovers or friends, and we're often walking side by side, hand in hand, from start to finish, sometimes it's twists and turns and oopsy daisies, but you sort of figure it out in the end. Every so often, you go apart and then find each other further along the path. But more often than not, it's like you know what our work here is done. I'll catch you on the flip side. And what the star wants you to remember is that we are all on a singular path. We are all on individual paths. We can't be pulling people along their paths, or yanking them onto our pass, even when it's obvious we know better, because that screws with their karma. You know, I've had to learn this the hard way with my own kids, even if it's coming from a very loving and protective place, you can prolong or enlarge the lessons that other people need to learn when you try to carry burdens that are not yours to bear, all you can do is have a handout to say, You know what? I am here to hold your hand and walk alongside you on our respective paths, but I cannot pull you along your path. I can't yank you along mine, and I will not wait. And do you see how when you understand that we can't be living everyone's lives for them, that screws everything up for everybody, and also the role that destiny and our free will play in our lives, that is what helps you tap into the luck of this card and move forward with more ease success and grace and scene.

34:56  
Wow, did I ever need to hear that?

34:59  
Yeah, I felt. It because I'm sweaty and goosies, that's how I know girls.

35:02  
I want to know how you feel, but that's one of my biggest struggles, is letting people go. I'm feeling guilty, like my brother in particular. I brought him up many times on this podcast. My older brother and he was incarcerated for almost 30 years. You know, I did everything to happen, but when my parents died, it was like my door opened, and I thought very briefly that I could get away from him, because I did it for my mom. You know, I did it for my parents. I drove them to him. I did everything. Can you not do this for him? Would it kill you to just get him $200 Well, can't you help him get that car started like it was this endless climb up a mountain. So thank you for that. I knew I feel like I'm doing the right thing, because my life's better, but man, did I ever need the star card today, girls?

35:55  
Well, I mean, I've had and I'm very open about it. I have had enough therapy I could have just gone to Switzerland to have, like, a team of scientists study me the amount of hours I've spent in therapy from like, traditional to non traditional, CBT, all of it, and the amount of correlations there are between what Laurie just said and what I've learned over probably 1000 hours at least in therapy, because it is removing yourself from like that guilt, because you realize that energetically, it is a black hole to constantly think that you can save other people. You can show them the way. You can be there with them. But ultimately, everyone is their own responsibility. And for some people who who think of that in an isolating, negative way that feels scary to them when you say, like, I can't fix this for you. No one can. You have to fix this for yourself. Some people will view that as being very scary and almost that you aren't caring for them, but it is actually a very caring and empowering thing to say to people and for them to realize for themselves, only you save you like you look out for you. And that's not saying that the rest of the world doesn't care about you, but it is like an absolute truth in this life that you can save yourself as it is possible. So if anyone's listening to it, going, Oh, I'm struggling, and it feels like nobody cares about me. It's not that they don't care about you, it's that they physically can't do that work for you. And you can rest assured that when you start doing it for yourself, you're gonna feel so much

37:13  
physically can't do that

37:14  
work for you. And like Lori said, like you can't make other people care about the things you care about, if you really sit with that, that's quite empowering in making your own decisions about what you're going to

37:26  
carry with you. Well, it free. You're not doing anyone any favors trying to carry their burdens, right? And honestly, I really needed to hear that message today, too, and it correlates directly with a conversation I was having with a really dear friend of mine about an hour before we got on this call. So it's blowing my mind in equal measure,

37:43  
it's really emotional, but that's the thing you know with Tarot cards, with if this is the connector that will help you think about your energy and your power and your ability to change and to take on hard things and to grieve. If you have to ball your head off in winners for four hours when you're looking at jackets, that's okay too. Can be stressful. Lori Diane is our guest today. Big deck energy is her new book. It's lovely, magical, empowering. It's a connector. It's so funny I can, I could flip any page open right now and make you laugh with a sentence in here. And laughter is magic. It's, it's Caitlin's elixir.

38:28  
Guys, we might want to make this like, let's say, come June, whoever's up for our book club, we should put this in

38:33  
our would you? Would you like to be in our book club?

38:35  
Laurie, yes, please.

38:37  
That's a great choice. We

38:39  
could have you come back and we could talk with some of our Patreon folks. June

38:44  
will be my month for the book club, so I can confirm now that that will be my June pick. Caitlin

38:49  
looked at her calendar. I just did it out here. No

38:53  
things are happening here. Thanks so much for being on the show today, Laurie, we appreciate you so much. We just love you. We love having you on I think everyone comes away from these conversations feeling a little taller and just a little stronger and a little more connected to the people around them. I love what you said. You know, you start off alone, you end up alone, but the in between, when we get to hold hands,

39:13  
yeah, and we should also say the book is available June 24 but available for pre order now, and I'll have all the links, you know, whether you want to do Amazon or indigo, I've got all the links in the show notes.

39:25  
And also you can still get, like, if you haven't already read burn your shit. And that was Laurie's last book, all about, like, the magic of full moon rituals. And you might have seen this stuff, but it breaks it down really well for you. And again, that friend of mine who recently had a reading with you was talking about what she just did for the full moon in leo. Like, it's just it is empowering. So check that out too. That is out already. I have to just

39:45  
brag a little bit, because a song that I wrote many, many years ago, one of my favorite lines in that song, it's called Waiting in Canada. Write down the things you don't want burn them in a cup. Write down the things you dream of. Of make a paper plane that flies to heaven. So it's just one of my favorite lines in the song. And every time I sing those words, I really remember it, you know. So there is power in that. Thanks again, but we will see you June for our Jan Arden book bag club.

40:17  
It'd be my honor. Thank you. I just loved it same time next week, right? Yeah, we're good.

40:21  
Careful what you wish for.

40:25  
I love you, babes. Thank you.

40:27  
It has been fantastic talking to you. Lori, Deanne, and until next time, everybody totally do you.